I was at (I don't remember where, but there were books), looking for new books for the twins. Granted, they're only six months old so my selections are light on the content and heavy on the is-this-short-and/or-partially-edible? BUT. They're starting to show signs that they understand when I speak to them, like turning when I say their names and lighting up at the mention of food (ah, sons after my own heart), so I'm becoming more focused on reading them Good Kiddy Books, as opposed to This Book Is Drool Proof.
So, back to the (I don't remember the store name) incident. I was looking at a book about a pig ballerina...Olivia...? It looked cute. I like talking pigs. The drawings were brightly colored, something babies seem to appreciate. Cue old lady..."what adorable little boys!"
Me: Thankee.
OL: Do you read to them often?
Me: I do, yes.
OL: Oh, Olivia. My granddaughter loves that book. But it's a girl's book! They won't like that!
Me: ...they're six months old...I don't think they care what it's about as long as the corner fits in their mouth...
OL: .....
Me: ..... *smiles, scoots away*
Now, this lady wasn't rude or even critical- she was very sweet in that Neighborhood Grandmother Who Makes You Cookies sort of way. But the encounter left me thinking about a NYT article I read a few months ago that made the claim that boys aren't reading YA because most YA is written to/by/about ladies, and boys don't like reading about ladies. It also reminded me of when my husband read Gone With the Wind, which was back when I was pregnant. His coworkers ribbed him for reading a "girl" book- which he ended up loving so much we named our oldest twin Rhett. (Also, what the hell? No one ever gives ME crap for reading a "man's" book).
Thinking back on my own childhood reading experience, it was pretty Little House on the Prairie, Anne of Green Gables, Babysitter's Club, Nancy Drew heavy. Neither my parents nor my teachers ever suggested that I read a book with a male protagonist extracurricularly, though we were assigned several. It was only when I was old enough to have a feeling about what books are considered Important that I started purposefully seeking out novels with male protagonists. And this wasn't purposeful, I wasn't thinking "icky boy books, no me likey." It was the result of a guided reading experience combined with what I was expected to like, as a girl.
I don't really want that for my boys. I don't want them to shy away from picking up a book because they're expected to like something else, or because the protagonist is Other Than Me. I don't want them to turn down Island of the Blue Dolphins, which kicks MAJOR ADVENTURE ASS, just because they main character is a girl. I don't want to make assumptions about what they'll be interested in based on the fact that they are male. But, on the other hand, I'm not going to raise them without any concept of being boys. If they end up wanting to chase each other around pretending sticks are guns, and playing cops and robbers, whatever. I think there's a balance, and it stems from not expecting them to be x, y, or z, just because of their sex. But I do want to expose them to books with girls, and books with main characters that aren't white, and books with main characters that aren't human, and books about...everything.
I WANT THEM TO KNOW EVERYTHING.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, my son isn't going to "catch girliness" from reading a book with a pink cover. In fact, reading books with characters that are unlike him will probably make him more open minded and accepting of others- which is important in a time when bullying is a big issue. So if my kid wants to read Olivia, awesome. If he wants to read Huck Finn and The Red Badge of Courage over and over, awesome. I just might slip a copy of The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe between the pages because...go Lucy.
Anyway, what are your thoughts? Can/Should kids read books that are obviously made for the other gender? Why are some people made so uncomfortable by the sight of a little boy reading something intended for a female audience? Are they that uncomfortable with femininity? Discuss.
Have you seen that Glee episode (season 1) where the boys are all horrible to the girls and Mr Schu makes them sing "What It Feels Like For A Girl"? (which I think is by Madonna) basically it suggests that "we" (boys, society at large, even girls) think being a girl is weak/degrading/not as good as being a boy.
ReplyDeleteTherefore... I think this is part of the whole "why don't men read female authors"/"boys shouldn't read girly books" yada yada. Although people may not harass you for reading "boy books" - I get some raised eyebrows for my taste in daft thrillers e.g. Clive Cussler/David Baldacci/Chris Ryan, all with very obviously boy covers.
I think kids should read books obviously made for the other gender if only to teach them that you can't catch boy/girl germs, they don't exist. Although I was talking about this with husband today - he said he found the Enid Blyton books really dull (not just the boarding school ones which all have female protagonists, but also more gender equal ones like Famous 5/Secret 7), which I had loved. So I think people will limit their own reading to whatever they find interesting. i.e. give boys "girl books" and either they will be interested and read, or they will not, in which case, il n'y a pas du drama, right?
In general - people being uncomfortable with femininity? I'm not going to get into that one or I'll still be here next week.
(By the way, hi, I'm not sure I've ever commented here before, but I'm a long time Google Reader lurker :-) )
My 12-yr-old niece says The Hunger Games books are popular with the boys in her grade, so that is evidence the YA trend might be changing! She told me this when I was convincing her to read the HG because I loved the series so dearly, which shocked me because neither YA nor science fiction are my faves. And while the "here's where we explain the obvious" aspect of YA lit can be tiring, the story was so good I overlooked it. My male ninth grade students definitely prefer male protagonists, but I think a lot of that is maturity--they're more comfortable with the twisted world of Poe's narrators than they would be with say Jane Eyre.
ReplyDeleteI work at a library and teen boys are constantly getting out Vampire Kisses and Twilight books, which are geared toward teen girls (I am female, I find them obnoxious, and I will not read them- cue prolific use of exclamation marks). I know not why, but it be the truth. Hey, if it interests them, why not?
ReplyDeleteWe shouldn't be so label happy as a society.
Reading- Exactly- it's not "catching." That seems to be what people fear. Like if your son reads a book with a pink cover, he's going to catch...pink?
ReplyDeleteKara- My husband just read and enjoyed The Hunger Games. He said that when he was a boy, he didn't care if the narrator was a girl, but the book had to be exciting. Maybe some boys just want the adventure, and don't care about the narrator.
Anon- Sure thing, jelly bean. Although...they may be reading those things to impress their girlfriends (I jest, I jest)
"In fact, reading books with characters that are unlike him will probably make him more open minded and accepting of others..."
ReplyDeleteThat is exactly why I want my kids to read books about anything and anyone. My teenage son read The Hunger Games a few months ago and loved them. I would never have told him he couldn't/shouldn't read them. I want my kids to have diverse reading experiences.
I think it is only a big deal about being a "boy" or "girl" book (or other things) if the adults in the kids life make it a big deal. I think my SIL and Brother may have gotten my oldest nephew down that road, so it would be hard. But I think he would love The Hunger Games, because of the promise of violence (he is still in an 'army is cool/ lets kill things phase'. I've more tried to get him things closer to his interests or pass on some of the classics. Heck, one of my favorite series, pre college years, was the Nancy Drew and Hardy Boys Super Mystery. Nancy Drew gets to kick butt, and do things not typical for her by herself.
ReplyDeleteJust got a major Princess Bride flashback..."Is this a kissing book?".... he ended up loving it anyways
So now I've realized that I've purchased books for my nieces and nephew largely based on gender. *shame* My nephew is almost 8 and is a reluctant reader so I wonder if expanding his reading horizons may help him. Thanks for the eye-opener.
ReplyDeleteI strongly preferred reading Nancy Drew mysteries to the Hardy Boys when I was a kid because I wanted to BE Nancy Drew; however the Hardy Boys TV show with Shaun Cassidy was - to my 8 year-old self - delightful.
Absolutely! Not only is it "okay," I think it's better. Like you said, it can only make them more open-minded, accepting individuals. When I have kids, I plan to read them "Why Heather has Two Mommies..." My kids may not be able to relate, but they will be able to open their minds and accept. Similarly, I'm buying my niece trains for Christmas. Why? Because trains are awesome and nobody else in the family will give her "boy" toys.
ReplyDeleteI was surprised to think of "Olivia" as a girl book. I picked it because she wakes up and "moves the cat" (picture of a little girl/pig carrying a limp cat under the front legs).
ReplyDeleteBut the stuff she does and thinks about isn't very girly (ballet just a tiny bit of the book).
also, thanks for the laugh re: babies' quality book criteria
We read lots and lots - we being Mom, son and daughter (kids one year apart) -- and I don't remember boy v. girl books. (My bible was the NYT Best Books for children- an invaluable resource for all ages of kids.) Perhaps Captain Underpants or the X-Man books were more for boys, but otherwise I can't recall any distinction. Amelia Bedelia perhaps a girl series (?) but my son loved it as well. Daughter read the Ramona books on her own, that's probably for girls. Is that Olivia with her brother pig (can't remember his name)--if so, I loved that series, and I don't recall it being geared to either gender.
ReplyDeleteI can think of boy v. girl TV shows - Power Rangers, Ninja Turtles - more than books being for girls v. boys. You may have a lot of years before you're dealing with this issue, and when the that time comes, they'll read what they like anyway.
In high school my son was assigned The Scarlet Letter, The Awakening and Madame Bovary all in a row, and said he was sick of all this "female empowerment stuff" when females (i.e., his mother, teachers) already have plenty of power. What could I say?
I find a difference and a preference is legitimate - sometimes the decidedly male point of view is irrelevant because the book is so great (War and Peace), but other times I can't get into it, it's too male (John Updike, Portnoy's Ccmplaint). By the same token I don't think my son would like the Brontes, or Jane Austen, either at his present age of 20 or ever, and that's o.k.
As for the time before they start to decide what they want to read - so much of the value is in the snuggling up and reading aloud to rapt attention. Many happy memories for me - Enjoy!
Amen to all that! My second is now five and we read all sorts to books. There is no difference in his attention span or enjoyment level when the book is about a girl as opposed to a boy. The real issues are is the story enjoyable, well written? How are the illustrations? Most importantly will Mummy enjoy reading that particular book multiple times? It appears that my perception and my willingness to discuss the book is also important. All the best and enjoy these precious times.
ReplyDeleteI actually never thought about what I read as a child in terms of protagonists and if it were meant for girls or not. I don't even remember that being an issue then (just for reference, I'm 32).
ReplyDeleteBUt now I think of it, many protagonists of Croatian children literature were male (not all, but many, as were the writers too). And I remember playing with other children, both cops and robbers, and playing at home with my dolls (and cars too, with my sister).
The only time I remember my mother mentioning the fact that I was a girl and should observe some "girly" type of behavious was when I started going out and it was more in the line of "what will neighbours think" (I don't need to mention it was the only time she mentioned that particular phrase). :)
I seem to have lost my thread.
Basically, what I'm trying to say is - I have no idea where this (in my mind) imposed line between what is for grls and what is for boys came from because I don't remember it being there in my childhood.
As my other love from books are perfumes, I also try to inform people that smells are universal - masculine and feminine are artificially imposed perfume criteria which didn't exist 100 years ago.
Preferences aside, preconceptions are wrong.
I never read, and rarely still will read, "girl" books; however, I don't see anything wrong with reading anything you want to read. My sister, actually, used to get Nancy Drew books as gifts all the time, but whenever she would go buy books for herself, she would ALWAYS get The Hardy Boys.
ReplyDeleteI mostly bought Goosebumps. And more Goosebumps.
I wrote about this same issue a few weeks ago.
ReplyDeletehttp://literarylindsey.blogspot.com/2011/09/wednesdays-with-david-boys-and-girls.html
My little guy will be 4 in September. I make a concerted effort to read books with him about boys and girls, written by men and women.
But I have to admit that it made me take a serious look at my own reading and realize that I mostly read books written by women. I certainly didn't choose books because they had female authors. But now I have to wonder if I should make an effort to read more books written by men or if picking up books based on gender instead of interest is the whole problem to begin with...
My baby isn't due until February and already I am getting those annoying comments about whats suitable for a boy and a girl.
ReplyDeleteWe were looking at a car seat that had red trimming and my mother-in-law said we shouldn't buy it because if we have a boy they can't sit in a seat with red on it. WTF!!!!!
Then a colleague was talking to me about how we are going to do up our nursery. My reply was that other than moving out the old single bed and desk and replacing it with the baby furniture we aren't even going to paint it - it has blue walls and carpet. Her response was that its ok for a girl to be a blue room, but if it was pink and we had a boy then we would have to change it...... WTF again! I got a bit cranky and said I am pretty sure the boy will know its a boy without reference to what colour the wall of its bedrooms of painted.
Anyway, my point is - people need to get over this boy/girl stuff, with car seats, walls and books. Life is too short to stress about stupid stuff like that.
And why is it that people seem to think that it is the boys that are more likely to be confused by 'girly stuff' than girls with 'blokey stuff'???? Double standards methinks
ReplyDeleteLate to the conversation (as usual) but I decided that I didn't care whether books were girl books or boy books so my guy, now seven, has already been exposed to Pippi Longstocking, Madeline, Mrs. Piggle Wiggle and more. It's not going to do anything to him but give him an open mind when it comes to choosing books. P.S. He liked them all.
ReplyDeleteThis post and all the comments made me think about the books I read in elementary school--Nancy Drew, Hardy Boys, Harry Potter, and a lot of Goosebumps. Neither I nor my parents really thought about whether those books were for boys or girls. I wanted to read them because I liked them, and that was the important thing. I just realized how lucky I was, because my reading choices weren't limited by the "THIS IS A BOY BOOK AND YOU ARE A GIRL" mentality.
ReplyDeleteMy father bought me the first 20 Nancy Drew AND Hardy Boys books when I was about 10. I did prefer the ND's (went on to read about 120 of them, but only read those first 20 of the HB) but I read a lot of "boy's books" when I was a kid. It's mostly boys who won't read girly books, in my experience. But I was very happy recently to have twisted my BF's arm to read Island of the Blue Dolphins (my all-time favorite book when I was a tween) which he really loved.
ReplyDeleteI hate ALL books written for either gender...or any race. If the author starts out with that thought in mind, it kind of ruins the whole story for me. I know that people who write for specific age/gender audiences don't set out to piss people off, but I can't help sensing a bit of snobbery when somebody says "You're not manly/girly/white/black/Chinese-y enough to appreciate this work of art. Go away." That being said, it doesn't mean that I hate art that deal with certain gender or racial issues, or that a MC that isn't a white male like I am bothers me at all. For example, I LOVED "Lust" by Susan Minot, "A Raisin in the Sun" by Lorraine Hansberry, "Katchamka" (movie) by somebody in Argentina, "To Kill a Mockingbird" (Greatest novel of all time IMHO), "Misery" (in translation) by Anton Chekhov (Greatest short story of all time...by far), so on and so forth. I don't care if the author is speaking about an issue that impacted them as a girl/man/minority/majority, in fact, if that's the story inside of them, I would call it an artistic sin to NOT write it. However, a good story that deals with these issues wouldn't need to say "Ok girlies, let's talk about a woman's experience with rape" to reach the intended audience. Typecasting art makes the author seem snobby, because they assume that the audience needs to be hammered over the head with the fact that they SHOULD emphathize with the MC. It's also offputting.
ReplyDeleteJust to be up front...I have no children. That being said, I remember the stories I read when I was younger and they crossed pretty much every line there was to cross. I read things with all sorts of protagonists, authors, POVs, even some books that were probably a little too mature for me at the time. Nobody said word one. I don't think my parents even knew what book I was reading at any given moment. Which I feel kept out any unconscious prejudices and/or favoritism. I will however say that I think the window for young girls is open wider in terms of reading variety. As you said Amanda, no one ribs me for reading a "guys" book, if anything I would be expected to see it as a compliment if someone were to remark on it. The standard does not work the other way; it is an insult to a guy's masculinity to be seen reading a "girls" book (OK, not all the time, and everywhere, but you get the idea). This is not good. But then, how do you change it without somehow changing all of society? So I'll stop rambling now.... but great post!
ReplyDelete